From: heb_roots_chr@mail.geocities.com
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 1997 11:50 PM
To: Hebraic Heritage Newsgroup
Subject: Re: "Gathering together unto Him" (II Thess 2:1-3)
From: Kelli Morgan
To: heb_roots_chr@geocities.com
Subject: Re: Rapture-Wedding-Sukkot
Shalom Eddie.
Thank you for the stimulating teaching and discussion. I have another
question re: rapture. In 2 Thess 2:1-3...."Now we request you, brethren, with
regard to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and our gathering together to
Him, that you may not be quickly shaken from your composure or be disturbed
either by a spirit or a message or a letter as if from us, to the effect that
the day of the Lord has come. Let no one in any way deceive you for it will
not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is
revealed, the son of destruction,..."
Does "our gathering together to Him" refer to the rapture of the bride? If
so, Paul states that it will not occur until the "man of lawlessness is
revealed" and goes further to say that he "takes his seat in the temple of
G-d, displaying himself as G-d". At the midpoint of the seventieth week, (3
1/2 years), he takes his seat in the temple, according to Matthew and Daniel.
Wouldn't this place the rapture at a later date than the beginning of the
last week?
I'm a little confused on this one....help :).
From Eddie:
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The phrase "gathering together unto Him" is a Jewish phrase
that refers to those being of the same family being buried together
and spiritually refers to the "resurrection of the dead".
In Genesis 25:8 it is written:
"Then ABRAHAM gave up the ghost and died in a good old age, an old
man and full of years and was GATHERED TO HIS PEOPLE"
In Genesis 35:29 it is written:
"And ISAAC gave up the ghost, and died, and was GATHERED UNTO HIS
PEOPLE, being old and full of day ..."
In Genesis 49:33 it is written:
"And when JACOB had made an end of commanding his sons, he gathered
up his feet into the bed, and yielded up the ghost, and was GATHERED
UNTO HIS PEOPLE"
So, we can see the Patriarchs, "Abraham, Isaac and Jacob"
when they died being described as being "GATHERED UNTO HIS PEOPLE".
Therefore, the phrase in II Thess 2:1 "our gathering
together unto him" refers to the resurrection of the dead and the
coming Messianic Age as it was understood that "Abraham, Isaac and
Jacob" would be leaders in the Messianic Age (Matthew 8:11).
There are those who do not believe in a pre-trib rapture.
IF there is a pre-trib rapture, ONLY the BRIDE (not the entire church)
will go.
However, this I WILL GUARENTEE you. The entire church
(including the Bride) WILL see DIFFICULT times in the near future.
Whether these difficult times are BEFORE the trib or
part of the events of the trib, only time will tell but we WILL see
VERY DIFFICULT days in the near future.
Either way, I want to be prepared and ready. I want to be
one of those "watchman" on the walls.
It probably is not good to start a pre-trib, mid-trib,
post-trib debate on this newsgroup. The MAIN issue is that the BRIDE
has MADE HERSELF READY. Let us all begin to prepare our hearts to
meet our heavenly bridegroom !!! The time is NEAR !!!!
Eddie Chumney
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My prayers are with you and your ministry. b'shem Yahshua. Kelli
----------
From: heb_roots_chr@mail.geocities.com
Sent: Tuesday, July 22, 1997 10:46 PM
To: Hebraic Heritage Newsgroup
Subject: Re: "Gathering together unto Him" (II Th
From: David Walker
Organization: http://members.tripod.com/~dwkeys/armory.html
To: heb_roots_chr@geocities.com
Subject: Re: "Gathering together unto Him" (II Thess 2:1)
heb_roots_chr@mail.geocities.com wrote:
>
> It probably is not good to start a pre-trib, mid-trib,
> post-trib debate on this newsgroup. The MAIN issue is that the BRIDE
> has MADE HERSELF READY. Let us all begin to prepare our hearts to
> meet our heavenly bridegroom !!! The time is NEAR !!!!
>
> Eddie Chumney
Eddie,
AMEN! While I hold a certain belief concerning the rapture, I accept
that I may be wrong, being only human, and that others hold different
beliefs. Regardless what we believe concerning the rapture, it should
have ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING WHATSOEVER on our faith in Yeshua. Too many
people have become so fixated on a pre-trib rapture that, if it turns
out they are wrong, they may very well lose their faith, if they are not
focused solidly on Yeshua and His word.
To anyone on this list that is counting on a pre-trib rapture: Ask
yourself this question--"If I realize some day in the future that the
tribulation has begun, and the rapture has not happened, will my faith
be shaken?" If the answer is "yes," or even "maybe," you're placing too
much emphasis on the rapture and not enough on Yeshua. Our "blessed
hope" is the fact that Yeshua IS returning, not WHEN.
Thanks so much for all the information you send out, Eddie. While I've
only been a "rooter" for a short time, and I still have a long way to
go, I've learned more from reading your posts, then I have all the other
time spent trying to find information anywhere else around the net, and
I thoroughly enjoy the Q&A. As soon as finances permit, I plan on
ordering your books so I can really start getting more informed.
Maranatha!!
Dave
From Eddie:
**************
The SPECIAL for both my books, "The Seven Festivals of the
Messiah" and "Who is the Bride of Christ?" is still available for
$32 which includes the shipping.
I am blessed that you are enjoying the newsgroup! It brings
encouragement to the ministry and makes the time and effort put into
the ministry worthwhile!
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